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Post by Iceshard on Jun 24, 2008 9:39:57 GMT -5
Keep in mind Gary Gygax also went off and made the Dangerous Adventures.. or something like that where your character sheet was about 4 pages long, it took dice rolls to decide what character class and race you wanted to be, and overall it was more paperwork than playing.. There is a reason DnD has changed so much and become more simple from what Gary had in mind -Ice
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Post by gwydion669 on Jul 6, 2008 0:44:34 GMT -5
I like the idea of a script making PvP akin to subdual. This would, however, make the previously mentioned bandit ambushes kind of silly. If you can't rob the poor shnoob, what's the point.
The "within certain comparitive levels" makes sense. I wouldn't want a group of 6th level bridge bandits slaughtering a 1st level newbie and driving him from the game.
And then you have that first level bigmouth (say, Maurice) mouthing off to a huge barbarian. He deserves to be pummelled ... but not necessarily killed.
There are so many different scenarios that the concept is a nightmare (and unavoidable to all but "LG only" PW's).
I do believe that certain areas should definitely be NO PvP ... the Elfsong would be a good choice. The other bar in town can be the "rowdy" place with subdual PvP. In relation to that, I believe that the Elfsong would be the best entry point to the module (Having reached Baldur's Gate, your quest for accomodations has led you to the Elfsong, yadah, yadah). Let the newbies catch their breath and learn the lay of the land. I read message boards first, but you can't blame someone for being over-eager. And I would like to have Maurice sitting at the bar, flirting with another character, when some homicidal nitwit comes through the door.
Ignoring their blows due to PvP settings, "Gentleman ... puhLEASE take such shenanigans elsewhere. Such behavior simply SHAN'T be tolerated here. Besides ... I JUST bought this shirt ... the finest silk from Calimsham."
I don't mind ambushes set up by a DM. Yes ... that adds realism to the setting. I don't completely buy PC's as bandits, though. "I'm RP'ing." Yeah, right. I think you're being lazy if you're picking on other PC's. Dude, this is an adventure game. Go out and adventure, don't just steal stuff from people weaker than you. Or contact a DM if you are serious about role-playing a Bandit Lord and ask him to set up NPC's for you to ambush. Rich merchant caravans ... complete with guards.
One more item and I'll shut up.
Paladins. Paladins, paladins, paladins. <sigh> I think alignment is relative and should be brought out by role-playing.
Maurice is evil. But he would have no problem working side-by-side with a paladin to collect the bounty on some PC or NPC bandit's head. A self-sacrificing tank to take the brunt of the blows? An alturistic sort (can I have his share of the bounty, then)? Killing off potential competition? The chance to LEGALLY kill someone while a paladin acts as witness? And gain fame in the eyes of the ruling elite and corruptable youngsters? Absolutely PRICELESS! The actions are good ... but the reasoning is evil.
A 20th level cleric of Orcus is EVIL. Even peasants might be able to sense his unholy aura. Paladin kills cleric. Yay, paladin!
Peasant Bob is a simple commoner. He cheats on his tithes to the Duke. He commits adultery. Two weeks ago, he got drunk and roughed up his wife. Peasant Bob shows up on paladin's "detect evil" radar. Paladin cuts off peasant's head. "He was evil."
I'd say the masses are scared s***less. The Duke is the same. Anyone who could conceivably have a skeleton in their closet is the same. And what does that particular paladin's church consider evil? If an evil alignment is thought of as a sign hanging around a person's neck reading, "Paladins, please kill me. It's OK," then there would be NO paladins. Frightened people would kill them on sight and burn their orders to the ground. And Maurice would be happy to throw the first torch.
The black/white view also gets rid of some good role-playing opportunities.
Paladin: You're evil! Maurice: Well ... I have been accused of being morally bankrupt. Paladin: Evil-doer! Prepare to be smited! Maurice: Just a moment, stud. Have you ever SEEN me kill anyone? Or perform ANY evil act? Paladin: Well ... no. But my radar went "ping." Maurice: Maybe I'm evilly inclined and MIGHT one day commit an evil act (you could prove). Should I be judged before committing any crime? Paladin: Well ..... Maurice: But you are right. I'm very naughty and should be punished. If you know a quiet place, I'll even bring the whip.
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Post by Iceshard on Jul 6, 2008 9:13:16 GMT -5
Paladins are like the spanish inquisition lol.. repent or die, doesnt matter if you have or havent committed evil... In their eyes you are prone to become evil, and so you should be purified. -Ice
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Post by gwydion669 on Jul 6, 2008 10:18:42 GMT -5
Personally, I like paladins as potrayed by Elaine Cunningham in the novel Threshold (I think) ... whatever was the last novel in the Harper series.
One paladin cresting the hill on his warhorse, fantastic!
An ARMY of paladins cresting the same hill ... RUN for your lives!
"So what happened, then?"
"The paladins went THROUGH the elves!"
Still one of the funniest images I retain from the various books.
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helbrandt
Member
Victory needs no explanation, Defeat allows none...
Posts: 45
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Post by helbrandt on Jul 7, 2008 8:37:33 GMT -5
Personally, I am willing to PvP anytime anywhere. I prefer for it to be for an RP reason. But if someone decides to Random me, then thats fine to. ( as long as I win lol ) But I do think that PvP should have an RP reason Unless it is an OOC fight that 2 people set up OOC. The Problem with the consent rule is the loud mouths that run their traps and then Deny consent. Applied consent is the best option in my opinion. Applied consent could be gotten from: 1: Insulting someone IC or OOC 2: Stealing someone's kill or loot from a kill 3: Pick Pocketing someone 4: Being in a guild 5: using Hostile actions towards a character (Attacking them, or casting spells on them) 6: Certain Areas such as arenas ( or maybe certain Taverns ) I don't care for PVP... (I get enough of this in real life, I'm a State Trooper) don't care for it but I'll participate in it for the sake of RP. I do however feel that I have to add one more situation to the above listed ones. I play a single class fighter...what you see is what you get. I have been with several characters who take several minutes (exaggeration) putting on a light show buffing their character up getting ready for a fight. Which of course makes them nigh on invincible for my simple sword swinger. So with that in mind if I'm rp'ing with someone and I think its going to go south and said individual begins speaking in tongues and waggling his fingers....or starts drinking a multicolored potion (IE buffing up)...I consider that a hostile action. No different than some dirt bag I"m talking to in real life who keeps putting his hands in his pockets while I'm talking to him. I don't know what he's got in his pockets, just like I don't know if player X is casting a light spell or Death Ray. If you come to an RP conversation already buffed up..so be it but don't expect me to stand by while you jump in the telephone booth and put on your blue tights and red cape. So... #7 Keep your hands where they can be seen and and don't make any sudden moves. Any type of spell casting or potion drinking during a "spirited conversation" is grounds for getting two feet of dwarven crafted steel in your gut.
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Post by grassblade on Jul 18, 2008 10:38:31 GMT -5
Did a lot of PVPing up till my mid-twenties (Brooklyn ). For the past 25+ years though, I have avoided PVP situations, so I don't see why I would want to PVP in a game. From what I've read above, though, virtually all of the respondents believe in PVPing to some extant -- different folks, different strokes -- therefore, I would recommend two things: 1) having DM Sojourn draw up the rules. 2) making sure all members (present, past, & future) are aware of the rules...emailing them, posting the rules on the top of every forum, the entrance of PVP areas, etc.
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jasonpauldegraaf
Senior Member
"There is a crack in everything God has made." -Emerson
Posts: 331
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Post by jasonpauldegraaf on Jul 18, 2008 11:11:56 GMT -5
Okay, I just wanted to add a few comments about PVP because of the issue that happened yesterday.
Here are a few griefs about an open PVP server (ie, PVP is allowed without consent if it fits into RP).
1) Open PVP servers can often kill RP. How does it kill RP? Anyone with half a brain and a search engine can Google "NWN 2 Power Builds" and come up with dozens of precious lil' Cleric-FS-bard-RDD-SLord-HIPS-Epic-Divine-Might-cookie-cutter builds that can easily tear through a mage, rogue, bard, or standard melee class in a few rounds. It's exhaustingly unoriginal, tiresome, and has been done before hundreds of times. And what happens when one of those build types tears through a non-consented player PVP is a few things called anger, resentment, vengence, and spite (to name a few). So instead of encouraging players to make original builds and characters, everyone feels the need to defend themselves and to go and makea power build. In no time we have Drow or a Deep Gnome divine casters with spell resistence a million running around trying to prove themselves.
2) It's extremely frustrating to Players. Congratulations PVPer, now everyone is mad at you and no one is having a good time.
3) It pushes those attacked to grinding: How? One of the immediate responses to being attacked without consent is "That's never going to happen again, so I'm going to run out and become and epic-level character." So now your PVP within RP will often cause others not to RP because they're too concerned about being attacked again and getting their next level. The very thing you set out to do ("I'm only attacking within RP, it makes for better and real RP") kills the very thing you wanted. Point in case yesterday: Time spent RPing that situation: On my end, approximately 15 seconds (I came on the scene a bit late). Time spent arguing about what happened (about an hour, maybe more, not to mention time posting that could have been spent on bios/journals and conversations afterward through tells).
4) It causes tension and strife between all parties invovled. Regardless of apologies being sent, people often hold grudges.
My hope is that some standard PVP rules are laid out in the near future. And believe me, if you want to see a RPer turn into a PVP player, I can build with the best of them. But I'd rather not do that. I love playing Amber Rose who is built for story, RP and PVE.
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Post by borton on Aug 6, 2008 17:02:54 GMT -5
thats all good but i think people need to given the chance to rp it out rather than to resort to violence like spot hind or hear skill to avoid it all
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Post by 3blackholes on Aug 11, 2008 19:15:44 GMT -5
Im down for any CvC thats IC. I only demand the respect that you set me to hostile, and give my party a chance to respond likewise before actually fighting in game.
As long as we are set to hostile before fighting begins, and its all in-character reasons, its all good.
J
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derf
New Member
Posts: 18
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Post by derf on Aug 12, 2008 13:57:53 GMT -5
Here's a question than...
If Joe the Mage casts a fireball spell and miss judges the range and Bob the fighter is just in the blast radius, what happens to Bob? Is he damaged?
If bob is damaged what does this mean for Joe? Is he auto set to dislike Bob and vice versa, so they can immediately go to combat, or do you still have to manually click your LIKE to DISLIKE?
Plus can players sneak attack by right clicking on a character and selecting the attack option without setting LIKE to DISLIKE?
Finally IF some one does attack someone and they quickly make sure their LIKE is set to DISLIKE against the guy or gal they just blasted or struck; does it terminate any chance for combat or is it unavailable while they are considered in combat?
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Post by joey1666 on Aug 31, 2008 4:04:06 GMT -5
Why is it high levels are picking on low levels at jorns farm and the trade way beside wolfs?
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Post by akasha on Aug 31, 2008 5:13:27 GMT -5
Why is it high levels are picking on low levels at jorns farm and the trade way beside wolfs? theswordcoast.proboards89.com/index.cgi?board=issueswithrppvp&action=display&thread=466#5586Because they are power hungry, and they must have inferiority complexes. IMO I think it is like junior high on the server. The 8th graders get to beat on the 6th graders and take their lunch money. But, it's ok because one day you get to be an 8th grader too. Then, it's PKing time. That's the message I got.
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Post by Isande on Aug 31, 2008 9:25:20 GMT -5
Odd...that's really not the norm on this server at all. I've run into someone who picked on me (in character mind you) for being a warlock, but other than that, everyone has been really nice. Keep in mind that some of the characters are evil or prejudiced against specific races so they will tend to keep in character with that. I know that my character doesn't really care for any sort of gensai. If she sees then, she's at least try to open a dialog, but won't normally go out of her way to be freindly. I'm sorry that has been your experience so far.
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tlantl
Active Member
Posts: 198
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Post by tlantl on Aug 31, 2008 9:47:41 GMT -5
Why is it high levels are picking on low levels at jorns farm and the trade way beside wolfs? What sort of griefing are you experiencing? It seems you are on at a time when the Asian and pacific players are on line. I have not seen this sort of behavior in a couple of months during US prime time. I suggest you give a detailed account of the behaviors and include player log in account names and the players they use. If nothing else others will be warned there are griefers and who they are. (screen shots) PvP is supposed to be by consent in a role play situation.
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BOGUS
Active Member
=Bjorl Barro=MAVERICK=17 lvl= ***with wolf and sylph***
Posts: 244
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Post by BOGUS on Aug 31, 2008 10:47:40 GMT -5
from Upon Death thread: I think death from PvP and death from monsters should be different and not switchable from one mode to another or having exploits like pet killing. Death from monsters takes 5% of exp - it is not a small prise even when you are 10 lvl in a half way to 11 lvl yet, and this is a real stress to loose because another player killed you and really strange when your are absolutely not affected by your death in PvP. Is it possible to make script, where winner in PvP is given 50*lvl exp (for example 10lvl will have 500 for PvP and difference between levels doesn't matter), and the one who lost - dropped dawn in this 50*lvl exp and after death is not taken to fuga, but taken directly to his Temple? (or he can lay down and wait for cleric as much time as he wants) ps my PC doesn't have that stone of switching modes - its normal or a bug? Helbrandt right - i made a mistake once, on another server, looking at one cleric who was buffing while talking, and i let him do it - result - he killed my PC and my friends, ye...in a blink of an eye when he buffed himself, so - casting is a provocation. Anyway - i played on PvP server, mostly people staying there to take revenge, because they were killed by someone - so they want to kill him, or they are idiots, who have fun ruining others fun from roleplay and exploring, or they are too young to wish peace at least at virtual world. I see really bad tendention here - prepearings for all days long PvP with UD races. Who will win in it? The best mutant build. PvP server and RP server NEVER go together. It's like water and oil - unmixable.
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