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Post by Tiefling on Dec 7, 2008 9:23:27 GMT -5
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Post by broham2 on Dec 7, 2008 9:25:32 GMT -5
If we didn't have penalties we'd be overrun with the "special races" which are supposed to be rare (I'd argue that there are already FAAAR too many, especially Drow).
My opinion is that the penalties should remain the same, and we should go to an app process to be allowed to play and ECL races.
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Post by driderman on Dec 7, 2008 9:30:40 GMT -5
I'm not arguing, I'm debating. Do you find me hostile? The reasoning for elves and dwarves having their weapon proficiencies (which I don't really agree with either) is that they're trained in the use of said weapons during their upbringing. It's a part of their cultural heritage as such. Seeing as Tieflings, Genasi and Aasimar are crossbreeds, they don't have the benefit of being trained in any racial weapons, as they're brought up with whatever race they were born to.
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Post by DM mithari on Dec 7, 2008 9:33:38 GMT -5
It's only really a penalty during the first "levels", before you catch up XP-wise with the ECL you're supposed to be. After that, you're meant to hang out with your level x buddies when your character is class level (x - adjustment) and get the same experience for each kill. If the table posted by Carnifex is correct, then this is how it does work in practice and it doesn't need any change. Oh, and the proficiencies are really a cultural thing. Granted, it's a little narrow-minded to think all dwarves have trained with urgroshes and waraxes, but still. It's mentioned in the PnP DM book that such things should be the first to go and be replaced if you go with the "race x raised among another race y" concept. Or maybe all outsiders have cultures where they fight in light armor with martial weapons and shields? Strange things, strange thing...
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Post by shorn on Dec 7, 2008 11:07:51 GMT -5
Ok ok, you folks have taken off the ECL question with your own likes and dislikes about it. My question was only if the additionally penalty (level 5 xp and level 5 penalty) was intentional. The penalty to ECL's is having the equivalent of 3 more levels of xp added on after 30, in total xp. All of the servers I have been to so far treat xp by awarding it per character level, not effective class level, so I was making sure. Now that it seems fairly certain that it was intentional, my question was answered. Now stop planning to bitch about drow, I know its coming
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Post by Tiefling on Dec 7, 2008 11:31:02 GMT -5
Or maybe all outsiders have cultures where they fight in light armor with martial weapons and shields? Strange things, strange thing... Yes, strange things... indeed. However, considering the 'special heritage' of tiefling and aasimar, how that heritage affects the surrounding society - I'd go as far say that those two races would be more 'likely' to become proficient in the previously mentioned weapon and armour. And in reply to Driderman: No, just a bit, dull. And with the word 'dull', I mean; you do not really arouse any interest or curiosity in me. Yeah, that’s a bit arrogant thing to say. Perhaps even offensive. But, in your reply you have a small contradiction in there. Let us say that a Dwarf family finds a small aasimar child in the wilds. Not being cold-hearted - the family decides to raise it as their own, setting all prejudices aside, raising the child as any other dwarven child. Then, wouldn’t the said aasimar child become proficient in dwarven waraxe as well? But I’m afraid NWN2, does not really offer a possibility for such character tweaking. Nevertheless I’d like to add how argumentation is a synonym to debate. Nevertheless, I’ll have to admit how a lot people tend to associate ‘heated’ or ’hostile’ exchange of words as the primary definition for ‘argument’. I admit arguments can be indeed heated and hostile, but I do not view it as the primary definition for the word. To argue is to simply put forth reasons for or against something, as an example. The same people tend to call that debating, where as debating for me is something between two biologist discussing their different findings about some rare species of spider and it’s mating habits. Edit: Oh and I'll just drop this subject from now on.
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Post by shorn on Dec 7, 2008 12:02:44 GMT -5
To add in a reply to that.
Argument is synonymous for debate. However, there are two parts to every word. Its Denotational meaning, that is, what it literally means, and its Connotational meaning, which is how it is percieved by other people.
Its the connotation of argument is, by and large, assoctiated with anger, annoyance, and two opposing points of views trying to convince the other that they are wrong.
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Post by driderman on Dec 7, 2008 13:16:43 GMT -5
Well seeing as the last two posts of tielfling says he doesn't want to discuss this topic (with dull, old me apparently ) I think I'll just find another more worthwhile place to post *shrug*
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Post by highwayman on Dec 25, 2008 21:00:51 GMT -5
Quick question here. Made an assimar cleric. At level 1 with 1xp to my name wolves were giving 12 per kill. I died a few times came back with half xp bar full and now they are dolling out 7 per kill. Not a big deal but was wondering if that's how an ecl penalty works or if it's the server. It's almost as if the game is applying challenge ratings based on xp amount of regular races and not the effective actual level.
Thanks guys.
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Post by broham2 on Dec 25, 2008 21:49:35 GMT -5
Yes, that is how it works. The XP is given based on what level you WOULD be at your given xp amount.
Bleh. ECL. Bleh.
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Post by highwayman on Dec 25, 2008 22:39:58 GMT -5
Thanks. I'll deal with it. It doesn't seem fair considering that your abilities stay the same. Oh well. Xp description is confusing.
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mrdeadman
Senior Member
I'll thank you to keep your reality out of my fantasy.
Posts: 308
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Post by mrdeadman on Dec 25, 2008 23:28:09 GMT -5
I can see where Shorn is coming from. There is a double penalty for handing out xp this way. The penalty of needing 3 extra levels worth of xp and then the penalty of getting less xp before you actually level. Doesn't take mathematics degree to figure that one out.
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Post by DM Sir Carnifex on Dec 26, 2008 1:15:39 GMT -5
An ECL +1 class is actually supposed to be like a level two, anyway. It would be unfair for the pseudo level 2 to gain XP at the rate of a level one.
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Post by DM mithari on Dec 26, 2008 5:37:50 GMT -5
An ECL +1 class is actually supposed to be like a level two, anyway. It would be unfair for the pseudo level 2 to gain XP at the rate of a level one. Indeed. In fact, under PnP regulations you'd (arguably) have gotten 7 XP per wolf to begin with.
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mrdeadman
Senior Member
I'll thank you to keep your reality out of my fantasy.
Posts: 308
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Post by mrdeadman on Dec 26, 2008 11:37:52 GMT -5
Let me put it this way... the penalty for an ecl 3 deep gnome is having to get 10000 xp to go to second level. You don't think that's harsh enough? Now you have to give them less xp so it takes them even more?
And sorry, I didn't play pnp after 2nd edition. for the same reason many 3rd edition players wont play forth edition.
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