lorgin2003
Senior Member
Dyn-o-miiiiite!!!
Posts: 373
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Post by lorgin2003 on Dec 10, 2008 16:54:40 GMT -5
to counter stoneskin and the like, offer a variety of items with damage resistance. so that someone could have , say, a pair of gloves with a pierce resist of 5 and a suit of armor with a slash resist of 10. however, you'd need to give a few other stats on the gear as well. such as a +2 str on the gloves and an AC bonus on the armor. i recommend increasing how much they soak slowly, so that you can stop when the numbers balance out.
now, i agree that +5 in itself isn't epic, but the number should be capped at that. PnP makes it very clear that +5 is the highest enchantment bonus any item can have. so instead of bumping that number up, add other abilities to the gear. a d6 of elemental damage, keen, a bonus feat (knockdown or cleave for example). you could even add a decent spell resistance to some of the gear as well. just don't go nuts and put 8 different things on one item. 3 or 4 minor abilities max. and don't forget that you can also add penalties on the items as well. if you make a cloak that gives a high resistance to cold, give it a weakness to fire.
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Post by caveman282 on Dec 10, 2008 17:09:30 GMT -5
I got a question...
Why is a Fighter suppose to be = to a caster?
I mean why is Joe the fighter suppose to be as good as Elminster the wizard? Thats the prestige of a caster is to be powerful at top end. The road to the top end should be a long hard tidious one. Almost to the point of giving up on the grind to become powerful. A fighter on the other hand should be strong onthe low end and easier to lvl, but at top end not so much. Sure they should be able to be viable. They problem is though that all the casters want to be meleers and all the meleers want to be pseudo casters with UMD and items to make them immune to magic.
If you add all these +4 items then you are balancing things but your also taking away the need for casters to use extend cats grace and such. By adding + saving throw items + resist items your only adding to the power of casters while increase the power of meleers.
I think the +2 Items are ok cause your not taking too much away from the casters. I take it everyones played the campaign with +11 items... To me thats horrid. Any char can be a god.
Just my thoughts on things.
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Post by DM mithari on Dec 10, 2008 17:23:31 GMT -5
In the end, it's a game.
Games are meant to be fun.
Many do not think it fun to take their fighter into battle, only to see a cleric or whatever steal the entire show by doing his job for him... And then a few others while he's at it.
Balance on the idea of "weak early for power later" or the other way around are inherently bad ways to balance a game since it generally impedes fun.
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lorgin2003
Senior Member
Dyn-o-miiiiite!!!
Posts: 373
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Post by lorgin2003 on Dec 10, 2008 18:17:33 GMT -5
I got a question... Why is a Fighter suppose to be = to a caster? I mean why is Joe the fighter suppose to be as good as Elminster the wizard? Thats the prestige of a caster is to be powerful at top end. The road to the top end should be a long hard tidious one. Almost to the point of giving up on the grind to become powerful. A fighter on the other hand should be strong onthe low end and easier to lvl, but at top end not so much. Sure they should be able to be viable. They problem is though that all the casters want to be meleers and all the meleers want to be pseudo casters with UMD and items to make them immune to magic. If you add all these +4 items then you are balancing things but your also taking away the need for casters to use extend cats grace and such. By adding + saving throw items + resist items your only adding to the power of casters while increase the power of meleers so... casters are supposed to rule the roost, and everyone else is supposed to play second fiddle? i can't say i like the sound of that. hands down, casters are the most powerful class types on the server. anything that helps the other classes isn't "taking away from the casters." it's giving something to the other classes as well. i can't understand why anyone would think that helping a non caster class somehow cheapens the casters. it just plain isn't true. no one's talking about giving fighters the ability to cast meteor swarm. if you think that all a caster is good for is a few ability buffs, then you're really missing out on the true benefit of the class. ah, the classic overcompensation. the OC's items are hideously high, so the best way to go about it is to make all the items hideously low? no. it's all about moderation. there's a clear middle ground that seems to get vastly overlooked. that clear middle ground is defined in the actual D&D rules. i posted the limits on magic items as per the DMG in the DM section. it's pretty cut and dry. combined with the item level restriction, you can clearly see what type of gear you can expect at each level. and +2 at level 20 is an insult. especially when a caster can get a +4 at level 3. so, it isn't a matter of "taking away from casters" it's a matter of helping other classes make up some ground. to assume that one class should have more privileges than any other class is ludicrous. especially considering that the "hard early, more powerful later" doesn't even really apply. you can get your first 10 levels in a day or two, so you're really "hard for a day, invincible for a lifetime." whereas a fighter or a rogue is "tough forever, cause you ain't a mage!" the classes all need certain things to be useful. the mages have all those things already, so it's time to help the rest of the group out.
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Post by luna on Dec 10, 2008 18:23:58 GMT -5
to counter stoneskin and the like, offer a variety of items with damage resistance. so that someone could have , say, a pair of gloves with a pierce resist of 5 and a suit of armor with a slash resist of 10. however, you'd need to give a few other stats on the gear as well. such as a +2 str on the gloves and an AC bonus on the armor. i recommend increasing how much they soak slowly, so that you can stop when the numbers balance out. This causes problems to. If everyone has DR then all the monsters have to be changed or they are gonna be to easy for everyone. exactly....
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Post by DEV Akavit on Dec 10, 2008 18:49:25 GMT -5
According to my perception the problem lies in the casters' ability to be perma-buffed due super long spell durations. This takes away the role of the melee characters as casters no longer need them to buy the necessary time to cast a few critical spells at the beginning of the battle. I like the idea of decreasing spell durations as that will force casters to decide upon buffing early for precaution or saving spells in order to make sure they don't run out too soon. If stoneskin, premonition and similar spells had a duration no greater than one minute per level (less might be even better) it would be plenty long for one battle. Eliminating perma-buffing would really slow down the power-leveling that is so often seen amongst casters. This would also encourage parties as clerics and mages would look to melee PC's for protection when their spells fail them.
People do point out that fighters are good because they can keep fighting at full strength where the casters might run out of steam. Eliminate the ability to buff with a dozen 24 hour duration spells and the warriors will be back in business.
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Post by dariusrechtak on Dec 10, 2008 21:12:51 GMT -5
+3 equipment, definately nice, but perhaps think of this instead of increasing the + to some rediculously horrendous number, because eventually AC is moot, hence power attack, NWN will never be balanced because fighter abilities like charge and bullrush are not in it, so arguing it is not neccesary but you can easily make equipment better than +3 without making it overpowered, armor with DR.. nice getting warmer, but more stat boosting equipment, if i had to choose betwene +3 fullplate or +1 fullplate with spell resistance 20 and dr 1/- im going for the latter, mix it up, all the great weapons are not all +5 they are usualyl +1 or +2 with cool stuff, like maybe a greatsword that casted dispell on hit, or a +1 dagger that has bonus to intelligence or sneak damage ((intel really for assasin class))
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