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Post by caveman282 on Jan 21, 2009 9:30:20 GMT -5
I love the languages in the system but as they are they are useless as anyone with a lore can understand them. This makes no sense to me as It takes much time and training to understand a language. Perhaps with a lore check they can determine what language your are speaking but not what you are saying.
Being a druid and speaking druidic to keep conversations private between members its annoying when anyone can understand you. I am sure the same goes for other classes like Cant and so on.
I was just wandering if there were plans to fix this or if its one of those back burner things cause I know there are more important items to work on.
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Post by hnefi on Jan 21, 2009 9:42:16 GMT -5
What is the language "Can't" anyway? It looks an awful lot like a bug (maybe the first word in an error message such as "Can't find language"?), but one of my language choices was forced to "Can't". It's also pretty strange that I can (and was forced to, due to high Int) speak Sylvan, Auran and other weird languages but didn't get Undercommon as an option when I made my Tiefling Anywya, I agree with caveman. Remove the lore check to understand languages.
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Post by caveman282 on Jan 21, 2009 9:49:06 GMT -5
What is the language "Can't" anyway? It looks an awful lot like a bug (maybe the first word in an error message such as "Can't find language"?), but one of my language choices was forced to "Can't". It's also pretty strange that I can (and was forced to, due to high Int) speak Sylvan, Auran and other weird languages but didn't get Undercommon as an option when I made my Tiefling Anyway, I agree with caveman. Remove the lore check to understand languages. ^^ Cant is a rogue language that only rogues can speak. It uses hand signals vrs words. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thieves'_cant
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Post by DM williamfredrickson on Jan 21, 2009 11:09:06 GMT -5
Maybe drastically increase the difficulty for a successful lore check on languages? Would that be hard?
William has a lore of 5, and he was able to understand about 45-50% of what an elf was saying during a conversation. I just pretended he had no idea what the fellow said.
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thegnomeherder
Senior Member
Bhaal, the Lord of Gettin' sum
Posts: 356
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Post by thegnomeherder on Jan 21, 2009 12:43:16 GMT -5
Yeah my and Ter were speaking Druidic around the Weave Masters and they heard everything, kinda annoying.
Also when you use Druidic the tab says undercommon..
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Post by DM Sir Carnifex on Jan 21, 2009 12:46:20 GMT -5
Yes, I say get rid of the lore check for languages. My level 1 at times was understanding draconic. The languages wouldn't be a problem if people would RP their characters' actual knowledge instead of reading what it says and then immediately understanding a new language, but I don't count on everyone to do that. Also when you use Druidic the tab says undercommon.. When you use any language other than common, it says undercommon.
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thegnomeherder
Senior Member
Bhaal, the Lord of Gettin' sum
Posts: 356
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Post by thegnomeherder on Jan 21, 2009 12:53:36 GMT -5
Yes, I say get rid of the lore check for languages. My level 1 at times was understanding draconic. The languages wouldn't be a problem if people would RP their characters' actual knowledge instead of reading what it says and then immediately understanding a new language, but I don't count on everyone to do that. Also when you use Druidic the tab says undercommon.. When you use any language other than common, it says undercommon. Hahah oh wow I never noticed D:
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Post by Zealote on Jan 21, 2009 13:13:10 GMT -5
When you use any language other than common, it says undercommon. When you click elven for instance, the box says undercommon, but if you click elven a second time, the box will show elven.
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Post by DM Sir Carnifex on Jan 21, 2009 13:21:43 GMT -5
When you use any language other than common, it says undercommon. When you click elven for instance, the box says undercommon, but if you click elven a second time, the box will show elven. Who clicks twice? Once is all that is needed.
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Post by luna on Jan 21, 2009 13:48:30 GMT -5
I kind of like the Lore check to understand languages.
I just think the check should be much much harder. It's definatley way to low and easy to understand others.
I would be rather interesting to if it could omit a few words as well. Perhaps randomly put a **** for a word so an entire sentance isn't easily understood.
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Post by DM cort on Jan 21, 2009 14:03:43 GMT -5
Yeah my and Ter were speaking Druidic around the Weave Masters and they heard everything, kinda annoying. Actually mages are supposed to be extremely intelligent, and therefore should understand more about languages. I suggest if you want to keep your conversations from being heard that you whisper. Besides it's not like we responded as if we understood you.
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Post by caveman282 on Jan 21, 2009 14:11:39 GMT -5
Actually mages are supposed to be extremely intelligent, and therefore should understand more about languages.. I somewhat agree here and some what do not. The higher intelligent beings should understand more about languages but thats represented in the number of known languages. But there are languages that even mages wouldn't ever be able to understand without being part of that class such as Druidic and Cant. Those are languages you cant pick at random like elf, gnome, dwarven. They are specialty languages. I do think this would be neat if it could be added .... VV Tongue of the Sun and Moon (Ex): A monk of 17th level or higher can speak with any living creature.^^ Add all languages applicable to the monk class so anyone with that lvl can speak any language.
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Post by DM Sir Carnifex on Jan 21, 2009 14:46:35 GMT -5
Yeah my and Ter were speaking Druidic around the Weave Masters and they heard everything, kinda annoying. Actually mages are supposed to be extremely intelligent, and therefore should understand more about languages. I suggest if you want to keep your conversations from being heard that you whisper. Besides it's not like we responded as if we understood you. Mages may be intelligent, but think about it? How many people know many languages? Intelligence is only a part of knowing a language. Another part is immersion in it, hearing it a lot, and actual study of the dialect. If you were to take a person with an extremely high IQ and put him in China, what are the odds that he could understand most of what the people say in a language which he supposedly does not know?
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Post by DM haunted on Jan 21, 2009 15:22:44 GMT -5
Yea , this originally started as tells between caveman and I , IG. I was planning on giving the Zhents their own language ,Damaran.Damaran is commonly used in the Moonsea region,which is where the Zhentarim originate.With my research I have studied into it further and zhents actually have their own language altogether called Jhander,but that isnt available.Also,I looked into which regions and the origins of each language in the game.For those of you that havent seen the full IG list of languages,there is easily over 40,try somewhere around 60ish different languages,perhaps more because I never took a count,this is just my estimation.There is a lot!!
Anyways,we figured whats the point of dishing out the language if everyone and a toddler can understand it.Near impossible for any character to be able to understand every language or even understand them.Which understanding them,should mean you can speak them as well.I have read numerous amounts of novels in the FR setting..Yes, common is the main language,everyone has their own accent and they can be distinguished by the well rounded traveler.
There should be no way IG that a character with the lore check can understand the language,but not be able to speak it.Given if your lore is in the 20s or higher your character should have the knowledge to either know the language and speak it or be able to just distinguish it and not understand it.
So perhaps there is a way of instead of being able to understand them all with a high enough lore,that every 5 skill points put into the skill after you reach 15 for example,a new language is available for you to pick.
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ovarf
Active Member
Posts: 197
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Post by ovarf on Jan 21, 2009 15:34:30 GMT -5
I would like to point out that i know a lot of people who can somewhat understand a spoken language and not speak it. (all of my grandparents where native Spanish speakers who understood a fair amount of English but couldn't speak it well enuf to jokingly claim english speaking.) the ***** idea has merit if its doable, but i do think high lore characters should have some idea whats being said nore do i think that its implausible to understand but not speak a language.
and yes the lore check should be much higher
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